Sad state of affairs

[Honda]

The Durham report clearly outlines the complete fraud of the Russian collusion story. The report is not kind to the department of Justice or the FBI. I have always been and am still of the opinion that the whole investigation was nothing more than the use of political power to keep a man from being the president of the United States. It doesn't matter if you don't like Trump, our government should not be used in the matter in which it was. It's scary as hell.

[Mike]

Agree.

[Sandman]

I’m confused.. “Fox” says one thing and CNN says the exact opposite..

My conclusion.. what really happened.. really..

[Truckman]

Even scarier are the separate wedges of division being driven more deeply in the American soul...When the common enemy of all finally makes its presence known, the time of union may have passed for an effective defense......Ben

[Honda]

I’m confused.. “Fox” says one thing and CNN says the exact opposite..

My conclusion.. what really happened.. really..

You don't have to rely on either one of those outlets you can Read it for it for yourself. If you don't have time, which is understandable, look for a highlight report from someone you consider credible.

[Kevin]

I dunno what to think.

On the one hand, I tend to agree with you, Honda, about people trying to leverage the power centers of government to gain political advantage. This, while bad, is not at all unprecedented, unfortunately. But that is people outside the FBI trying to manipulate the FBI.

I don't necessarily get the impression that what happened within the FBI is anything but sloppy procedure. Note that Durham does not recommend any criminal charges as a result of his final report and the whole investigation ended up with two people acquitted of charges and one person pleading guilty to altering the date of an e-mail to justify continuing a warrant. That's a lot of Sturm und Drang for such meager results. Durham's report recommended procedural changes which by and large are being implemented anyway. So I did not get the impression that there was any reason to think that what the FBI did was nefarious, just sloppy. They did not corroborate before launching a full-scale investigation and should have.

Now, one might assert that the REASON the FBI did not cooperate was due to some swampy conspiracy but Durham did not assert that and he has not been shy about speaking up about what he has found. So there is the issue of confirmation bias - if one thinks that the FBI is out to get Trump, then this is evidence but one would have to also note that the person specifically hired to investigate that very thing, who spent two years in the process, did not find anything actionable. So we are in the realm of speculation and opinion.

Another thing to consider is that a lot of what gets said and done in Washington seems to proceed from one's understanding of someone else's motivations, something that is very much subject to confirmation bias. "They are just doing this because they believe that...." I think that believing one knows, with certainty, the motivations behind someone's actions is one of the problems in politics today and leads to hardened viewpoints. I'm trying to avoid that.

So for me, in the Durham report, I see people in politics trying to manipulate the legal processes to undermine an opponent. Scummy, but not uncommon. I see the FBI going off half-cocked and in the process causing great damage to the political process because they got played. That is being addressed. And I see the benefit of the Durham report mostly in keeping the issue in front of the public that the FBI has awesome power and needs to be scrutinized closely when interfacing with the political system.

As for Trump, while the ends can never justify the means, there was one good thing that came out of the crapstorm of all this. As a result of this botched investigation, we all learned just how dangerous Russia is as it tries to manipulate our political system. Trump did not actively cooperate with Russia but he wasn't above passively accepting help from them and Russia was very interested in helping him become President. If nothing else, we learned much about how much danger we are all in from Russia that they are the enemy, not just competitors. That was a useful outcome. Does it justify the investigation? Well, that would depend on your perspective, I guess. As a person of Ukrainian heritage, waking the world up to the danger Putin represents can maybe justify a lot of individual damage. That was a hard sentence to write but it is true for me. If Lenin had removed Stalin from the line of succession, would we have saved millions of Ukrainians during the famine Stalin caused? Even if Stalin's removal would be for bogus reasons? Sometimes, moral philosophy takes a back seat since it almost always happens in a safe, warm environment, well away from the consequences of one's decisions. So these days, I am less sure of moral principles than I was when I was younger.

[UTAH]

I'm not trying to take sides (if there is one) on this issue. For, in the end, there are no indications that voters were influenced by the investigation or results therein.

On a related issue - polls show the sexual assault of E. Jean Carroll by #45 also did not impact his base.

Hunter

[Kevin]

THAT'S something I just don't get. Nine people look at the evidence and conclude that he violently forced himself onto a woman and it meant nothing but a joke to that crowd in NH on CNN.

I never understood the reaction to Mary Jo Kopechne either, though.

[FredK]

I'm waiting for an AI report to come out. Depending on what goes in will very the results.

[UTAH]

...Mary Jo Kopechne...

Yes, the infamous Chappaquiddick incident (had to look it up cause I can't spell it).

Hunter