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Thread: Just in from the WSJ---trump verdict

  1. #1
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    Just in from the WSJ---trump verdict

    Former President Donald Trump‘s family business was convicted Tuesday of criminal tax fraud, with a New York jury finding the Trump Organization engaged in an off-the-books compensation scheme to pay some executives in car leases, apartments and cash.

    The jury found two Trump Organization corporate entities guilty of all criminal counts they faced, including conspiracy, criminal tax fraud and falsifying business records. The two entities could face a total of more than $1.6 million in fines.

    The guilty verdict is a blow to Mr. Trump, who, while facing civil lawsuits and criminal investigations, declared his third consecutive presidential bid last month. The conviction and subsequent penalties for his company could compound the weariness from some Republicans who want to move on to other party leadership.

    Mr. Trump wasn’t charged in the case, but his presence loomed over the trial. Prosecutors said that Mr. Trump sanctioned the tax-free benefits, and personally signed some checks for private-school tuition for finance chief Allen Weisselberg’s grandchildren. During closing arguments, a defense attorney said Mr. Trump relied on an outside accountant who never told him the perks in question were illegal.

    “Mr. Trump and his family are not here on trial before you,” the judge instructed the jury on Monday.

    Mr. Trump has railed against the case on his social-media site, calling the charges “a case the likes of which has never been charged or tried in such manner before.”

    During the trial, which began in late October, jurors heard testimony from Trump Organization employees, a longtime Trump accountant and Mr. Weisselberg, the company’s chief financial officer and star prosecution witness who pleaded guilty to 15 felonies for his role in the scheme.

    Under an agreement with prosecutors, Mr. Weisselberg is expected to be sentenced to five months in jail, and likely serve just a portion of that, so long as he testified truthfully at trial.

    He is scheduled to be sentenced on Dec. 19.
    I call that a damn good start
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  2. #2
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    "Mr. Trump and his family are not here on trial before you"

    Yet.

  3. #3
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    Extracted from the NYT:

    Donald J. Trump’s family real estate business was convicted on Tuesday of tax fraud and other financial crimes, a remarkable rebuke of the former president’s company and what prosecutors described as its “culture of fraud and deception.”

    The conviction on all 17 counts, after more than a day of jury deliberations in State Supreme Court in Manhattan, resulted from a long-running scheme in which the Trump Organization doled out off-the-books luxury perks to some executives: They received fancy apartments, leased Mercedes-Benzes, even private school tuition for relatives, none of which they paid taxes on.

    The Manhattan district attorney’s office, which led the case against two Trump Organization entities, had previously extracted a guilty plea from the architect of the scheme, Allen H. Weisselberg, the company’s long-serving chief financial officer. Mr. Weisselberg, one of the former president’s most loyal lieutenants, testified as the prosecution’s star witness, but never implicated Mr. Trump.

    While prosecutors stopped short of indicting the former president, they invoked his name throughout the monthlong trial, telling jurors that he personally paid for some of the perks and even approved a crucial aspect of the scheme. The prosecution also sounded a drumbeat of damning evidence that spotlighted his company’s freewheeling culture, revealing that pervasive illegality unfolded under Mr. Trump’s nose for years.

    The company’s conviction — coupled with the prosecution’s explosive claim at trial that Mr. Trump was “explicitly sanctioning tax fraud” — could now reverberate through the 2024 presidential race, providing early fodder for opponents and their attack ads.

    It also might lay the groundwork for the district attorney’s office to intensify its wider criminal investigation into Mr. Trump’s business practices — and hush money paid to a porn star who said she had an affair with him — an inquiry that gained momentum in recent months, according to people with knowledge of the matter.

    The conviction on charges of tax fraud, a scheme to defraud, conspiracy and falsifying business records is hardly a death sentence for the Trump Organization. The maximum penalty it faces is $1.62 million, a rounding error for Mr. Trump, who typically notched hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue during his presidency.

    Yet the verdict represents a highly public reckoning for the Trump Organization, forever branding it as a felonious enterprise. A company that served as a launching pad for the former president’s tabloid celebrity, his star turn on “The Apprentice” and ultimately his political career, might now be best known for its conviction, rather than the hotels and golf clubs that Mr. Trump spent a generation building.

    The former president has blamed it all on a politically motivated witch hunt. But while his attacks on prosecutors might appeal to his most loyal voters, lenders and the broader business world might now shun his company.
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  4. #4
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    I believe corporate tax fraud may be more common than we think.. just not to the Trump Corp extent ..

    My buddy on Tilghman Island, he is an architect, prided himself in low tax bills.. everything belonged to the company.. fast forward twenty years, when you “make” little money, you receive minimal social security.. and when you make poor investments, you depend on your social security.. life is tough on Tilghman..

  5. #5
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    That is a sad conclusion but as my Mother was given to say----"you made your bed, now lay in it"

    Just a related thought on SS---I never factored it into my retirement planning for two reasons:

    1. I had no confidence that it would still be there when I did retire.
    2. I assumed the value would be negligible.

    I was wrong on both scores. It won't keep me in grand comfort but it isn't something to be ignored either.
    Last edited by Dave Grubb; 12-07-2022 at 03:54 PM.
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  6. #6
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    I had doubts about the survival of Social Security so I started withdrawing on the day I turned 62..

  7. #7
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    I started at 66, and immediately ran into the earnings limit
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    I had doubts about the survival of Social Security so I started withdrawing on the day I turned 62.
    Exactamundo - which is why I did the same.

    Hunter
    I don't care if it hurts. I want to have control. I want a perfect body. I want a perfect soul. - Creep by Radiohead

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    I had doubts about the survival of Social Security so I started withdrawing on the day I turned 62..
    I did the same...Doing the math, and considering the 25% reduction in benefits and my full retirement age of 66, I figured I would have to live to the age of 76 to break even with the money that came in from the early reduced payments...Beginning next month I lose that bet, but I consider it a win anyway......Ben
    The future is forged on the anvil of history...The interpreter of history wields the hammer... - Unknown author...

  10. #10
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    I think the same calculation for me was 82---that didn't take long to decide after that rolled out! The first year I had an income cap----I had to have my clients hold payments until Oct when my birthday came about.
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  11. #11
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    May we both lose our bets, Dave......Ben
    The future is forged on the anvil of history...The interpreter of history wields the hammer... - Unknown author...

  12. #12
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    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Grubb View Post

    Just a related thought on SS---I never factored it into my retirement planning for two reasons:

    1. I had no confidence that it would still be there when I did retire.
    2. I assumed the value would be negligible.

    I was wrong on both scores. It won't keep me in grand comfort but it isn't something to be ignored either.
    Same here on all counts.
    The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible - Arthur C. Clarke

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