I would have never thought that would be possible for him.....Originally Posted by TriGuy
Charter Member
I would have never thought that would be possible for him.....
Registered Member
It was either that or face perjury charges. There is no way he could tell the truth.
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible - Arthur C. Clarke
Charter Member
Trump
"You see the mob takes the Fifth," he said during one rally in Iowa. "If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?"
Fred
"Everyday I beat my own previous record for number of consecutive days I've
stayed alive."
'Take care of yourself, and each other.'
Registered Member
It seems the RINOS have had their feathers ruffled. Republicans are Rooting for Civil War after search of Trump's home.
The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible - Arthur C. Clarke
Charter Member
And trump will continue to stir the pot----he has no limits---it is all about trump
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
"Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
“You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis
Charter Member
#45 takes the 5th - which he has the right to do.
Though dealing with him is frustrating, we need to handle his case while giving him full Due Process rights. If we do not do so, his supporters will claim the legal process against him is invalid. We know him well enough to know he'll appeal any legal action(s) against him all the way to the SCOTUS.
No POTUS has ever gone through such a legal labyrinth. Yes, he's brought this upon himself - while putting the integrity of our Democracy at risk. If most of us stick to our legal procedures, our ex-President will remain an ex. If our system fails this procedural test, we all pay.
Hunter
I don't care if it hurts. I want to have control. I want a perfect body. I want a perfect soul. - Creep by Radiohead
Registered Member
An excellent summation, Hunter......Ben
The future is forged on the anvil of history...The interpreter of history wields the hammer... - Unknown author...
Registered Member
No POTUS has ever gone through such a legal labyrinth. Yes, he's brought this upon himself - while putting the integrity of our Democracy at risk. If most of us stick to our legal procedures, our ex-President will remain an ex. If our system fails this procedural test, we all pay.
Hunter
Just what has he done that puts our Democracy at risk ?. People have been after him for seven years and nothing .
Give me one thing he did to put the Democracy at risk . Hate him [ for some reason ] if you must but , put a few facts out there .
Individual rights are protected only as long as they don't conflict with the desires of the state .
Charter Member
He has loudly proclaimed that the election was stolen from him. Because of the conservative media ecosystem, people such as yourself believe him. Millions of people believe his lie and now some of these people are being elected to positions that can affect the outcomes of future elections. What happens to an electoral process when the people in charge believe that the process is rigged? You end up with January 6.
He pressured people in key states to throw out millions of votes cast in order to rig the election himself. He and his allies tried to get people in Georgia and Arizona to violate their oaths of office to proclaim him the winner in those states.
He and his allies created conspiracy theories about normal election counting activities, with the aim of casting more doubt on the integrity of the electoral process.
His campaign filed 61 frivolous lawsuits, 60 of which were summarily thrown out. No legitimate lawyer would file these suits - they were far outside the normal litigation that comes after an election.
When none of the lawsuits worked, he tried to overthrow the Justice Department hierarchy to install a sycophant who would, without evidence, declare irregularities in key states and seize voting machines.
He pressured his own Vice President to sign onto a cockamamie scheme to throw out the certified Electoral College votes in order to allow the Vice President himself to decide the winner of the election. Failing that, casting out the electoral votes would allow a slate of fake electors to be certified by the state legislatures, which would then vote for him and make him the winner of the election. When the Vice President refused to go along with this, he allowed a violent and armed mob to chase the VP and other legislators through the Capitol as they screamed for Pence's execution.
He refused to call out any armed response to the Capitol riot, watching as the mob hunted legislators and fought with Capitol Police.
He knew before the Capitol riot that people listening to him were armed and was irate when he could not lead this armed group towards the Capitol to overthrow the election.
All these facts have been attested to by Republican members of his own administration. They are not allegations, they are the result of his own staff testifying under oath. So I don't know what else you need to hear, IV, before you realize that Trump is a singular danger to our democracy. He's already shown it.
Charter Member
Must we go beyond trying to steal the election and illegally remain in office?
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
"Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
“You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis
Registered Member
Wait , I must have missed the film of Trump marching into the Capital . And I must have mis-heard him when he said to go to the Capitol and PEACEFULLY demonstrate . What people did at the Capitol is a separate issue and I M O cannot be pushed onto Trump . { I have been wrong before }
Asking for re-counts after elections is not , to my knowledge , trying to " steal " an election.
Individual rights are protected only as long as they don't conflict with the desires of the state .
Charter Member
What you missed was the documented testimony of several people, including Trumps staff, a Capitol policeman and the statements by Secret Service that Trump was irate when the Secret Service prevented him from accompanying the mob to the Capitol. He knew, according to testimony, that the crowd had armed people in it and wanted to lead them anyways to the Capitol. Yes, he did not go but it wasn't for lack of trying.
Yes, he said "peacefully", but he also wound them up, told them to fight and pointed them at the Capitol, then stood by and REFUSED to call in any assistance when when the crowd was beating the living **** out of Capitol police, erecting a gallows and hunting his own VP and legislators in the Capitol, preferring to eat popcorn and watch the TV in real time as it all happened.
He wasn't just asking for recounts. He was filing frivolous lawsuits that no legitimate lawyer would take on, using the legal system to engage in conspiracy theories about ballot machines that were controlled by dead Argentine dictators and hacked servers in Germany and voting machines that changed ballots from Trump to Biden and nefarious Sharpies in Arizona and on and on and on, in addition to pressuring Georgia to create enough votes for him to win that state and trying to throw out legitimate ballots in Michigan and Pennsylvania. Recounts are fine. This was not a recount process. It was conspiracy theory via the legal system.
And it ground up people. One woman was shot dead at the Capitol. Over 100 Capitol police were injured. One committed suicide. Election officials have been threatened with death. Rusty Bowers testified about how people harassed his daughter outside their home after Bowers refused to violate his oath as Trump's lawyers asked him to. Trump's lies had consequences.
The entire fake electors scheme was a coup attempt, IV. Presidents who are NOT a danger to the republic don't attempt coups. Quit trying to bury your head in the sand.
Charter Member
Our friend Kevin did an excellent job in pointing out #45's transgressions.
Now, keep in mind, he won't be found guilty of most charges, just some of them. I'm betting most of his detractors will be satisfied if he drops out and lays low (yeah, I too doubt that'll actually happen). He is a fighter - and seems to relish battle.
I worry more about what may happen if Donald goes down, but not because of him - because of what his supporters may do. At local levels, we've got groups that will disrupt public and government events and processes. At the national level, we've got our Justice System, Legislative, and Law Enforcement entities. I fear these fascist groups will purposely get in the way of our security, or cause enough distractions and workload impact that our security is lessened.
At this point, we've already had national politicians/legislators call for the de-funding of our security agencies. I didn't like it when other groups did it and I don't like it now.
Hunter
I don't care if it hurts. I want to have control. I want a perfect body. I want a perfect soul. - Creep by Radiohead
Registered Member
Yeah if he goes down I worry if we'll have the same thing that antifa and BLM did to our cities burning pillaging killing for months on end during the Trump administration. I'm hoping that his supporters will not do that.
OPINION....a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
Registered Member
Apples and Oranges..
The violence and law breaking that occurred during civil unrest that has been labeled as BLM violence should be prosecuted, fully prosecuted by local law enforcement.. The civil unrest that has been labeled BLM should not be equated to the insurgents action on January 6 at the US Capital, the insurgents should be fullyprosecuted .
The civil unrest label BLM had become a diversion issue used to attempt to offset and/or detract from the January 6 insurgents.. two separate issues.. one local, one federal… both need to be dealt with..
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote