Rusty Bowers Censured

[Kevin]

Arizona Republicans have cast out Rusty Bowers as a leper among them. According to the state Republican chairwoman, he is being punished for giving testimony against Trump. Arizona Republicans are being asked not to support him in any electoral contest.

For Rusty, I can only say that you need to remember just who your friends are. If you want a friend in politics, get a dog. Sometimes, you just gotta get out of Dodge and leave it behind.

The sirens are screaming, and the fires are howling
Way down in the valley tonight
There's a man in the shadows with a gun in his eye
And a blade shining oh so bright
There's evil in the air and there's thunder in the sky
And a killer's on the bloodshot streets
And down in the tunnels where the deadly are rising
Oh, I swear I saw a young boy down in the gutter
He was starting to foam in the heat

I'm gonna hit the highway like a battering ram
On a silver-black phantom bike
When the metal is hot, and the engine is hungry
And we're all about to see the light
Nothing ever grows in this rotting old hole
And everything is stunted and lost
And nothing really rocks, and nothing really rolls
And nothing's ever worth the cost

[Dave Grubb]

Stand tall Mr Bowers----you are a class act

You are better off being gone from that band of RINO scum.

[Dave Grubb]

I have to say---with all deference to our Arizonian friends---Arizona has emerged as a large crater filled with mindless rinos. Obviously, Barry Goldwater was not an "end" but possibly a "beginning".

In the interest of full disclosure, I was, at the time, a staunch Goldwater supporter in the day. But that was then and now is now, Barry is history, and I moved to the center.

[Scooter]

Anymore, Barry is the center.

As for me, as soon as the election is over, I am going to join the majority of Arizonans and change my registration to independent. Additionally, I will not knowingly vote for any candidate that has been endorsed by Trump.
Not because owhat he accomplished on office, because the current President has perfectly ruined something good in short order, but because I do not agree with or condone how he has handled the election results. However, I do think it has been magnified by the majority party in the house and senate, because in many ways, his cries have been similar to Hillary’s, and I have little doubt that if she could have, she too would have called for a march on the capitol, and it would have been called a vocal protest, or some such. I mean she still whines about her election being stolen with zero corroborating, legitimate evidence.

[Phillbo]

There is a reason I dont vote....

[UTAH]

The one that stands out for me is Liz Cheney. That woman seems fearless and I wonder how long her cohorts will let her survive politically. Personally, I hope she does.

Hunter

[Dave Grubb]

The one that stands out for me is Liz Cheney. That woman seems fearless and I wonder how long her cohorts will let her survive politically. Personally, I hope she does.

Hunter

Me too----the country needs her----the country needs people of her character in government. I hope that Wyoming has enough independents and Democrats to keep her in office.

In watching her last night, I thought to myself, that I have come to a place were character is more important than political positions.

I have to bow my head when I compare her consistent, unwavering, chutzpah which supplants any sense of personal political "cover" and what we saw last night. The likes of mcconnell and mccarthy "standing tall" and denouncing the insurrection right after the 6th compared to their now "modified" statements are shameful. Not to mention little boy hawley running through the halls of the capital to stay away from his "heros"----just in case. These spineless wimps are a pox on this nation!

[FredK]

Anymore, Barry is the center.

As for me, as soon as the election is over, I am going to join the majority of Arizonans and change my registration to independent. Additionally, I will not knowingly vote for any candidate that has been endorsed by Trump.
Not because owhat he accomplished on office, because the current President has perfectly ruined something good in short order, but because I do not agree with or condone how he has handled the election results. However, I do think it has been magnified by the majority party in the house and senate, because in many ways, his cries have been similar to Hillary’s, and I have little doubt that if she could have, she too would have called for a march on the capitol, and it would have been called a vocal protest, or some such. I mean she still whines about her election being stolen with zero corroborating, legitimate evidence.

Must be hard this election because almost a majority of people running that are Republicans according to the election pamphlet are wrapping themselves around the Trump flag. In fact I don't think I have seen one that hasn't.

[Kevin]

Anymore, Barry is the center.
However, I do think it has been magnified by the majority party in the house and senate, because in many ways, his cries have been similar to Hillary’s, and I have little doubt that if she could have, she too would have called for a march on the capitol, and it would have been called a vocal protest, or some such. I mean she still whines about her election being stolen with zero corroborating, legitimate evidence.

Not even close to equivalence. Trump is everywhere, in front of any microphone he can get, in front of any rally he can attend, mouthing off about how "we wuz robbed". Hell, he even started a social media platform devoted to himself and his complaints about a stolen election. He sends out missives "From the Desk of Donald J. Trump" about it to all the media. He is loudly endorsing candidates who buy into his delusions. Clinton is doing nothing like that. Mice and elephants are both mammals but there the equivalence ends and the same is true for Clinton and Trump. False equivalence is a way of spreading blame so one side isn't given the opprobrium it deserves.

And the "well, she would have done it if she could have" is also deflection. She didn't, Trump did. The complaint about how the media would have treated her, had she done something similar, is similarly silly. She didn't, so we won't ever know. Maybe somewhere there is a parallel dimension where she did, and the media treated her as you say, but in this timeline, it never happened so what might have happened if something else had happened is just Republican fantasy and more victimhood.

[Scooter]

Not even close to equivalence. Trump is everywhere, in front of any microphone he can get, in front of any rally he can attend, mouthing off about how "we wuz robbed". Hell, he even started a social media platform devoted to himself and his complaints about a stolen election. He sends out missives "From the Desk of Donald J. Trump" about it to all the media. He is loudly endorsing candidates who buy into his delusions. Clinton is doing nothing like that. Mice and elephants are both mammals but there the equivalence ends and the same is true for Clinton and Trump. False equivalence is a way of spreading blame so one side isn't given the opprobrium it deserves.

And the "well, she would have done it if she could have" is also deflection. She didn't, Trump did. The complaint about how the media would have treated her, had she done something similar, is similarly silly. She didn't, so we won't ever know. Maybe somewhere there is a parallel dimension where she did, and the media treated her as you say, but in this timeline, it never happened so what might have happened if something else had happened is just Republican fantasy and more victimhood.

Well, she was definitely on the talk show circuit talking about what happened, and even wrote a book about it. She is just a more polished politician as she did it, and she had congressional committees doing her dirty work. Things like Schiff constantly saying they had irrefutable evidence of malfeasance, and doing it multiple times in the guise of an investigation, that is the way the party in control can do it. You are right. They are different animals, but more like a horse and a zebra. They look similar, even though they have different lineage.

[Kevin]

Clinton handled her defeat by going on some talk shows and writing a self-justifying book. Trump sent an armed mob to kill selected members of Congress and his own VP. That's not equivalent.

Clinton conceded defeat and attended Trump's inauguration. Trump has never conceded defeat and refused to attend his opponent's inauguration. That's not equivalent.

Clinton faded into irrelevance within a year. Trump endorses candidates, speaks at rallies and created his own social media platform to spread his message. That's not equivalent.

Clinton accepted the vote of the people. Trump is still calling Republicans in Wisconsin to decertify the vote and reinstall himself as President. That's not equivalent.

Clinton bitched about not winning but she never led a movement of people who believe that the system of elections in this country are, at their root, systemic fraud meant to keep her from power that she fairly won but was robbed. That's not equivalent.

Adam Schiff uses the tools and levers granted him to legally if scurrilously and disingenuously oppose the President. Trump puts the power of the Presidency on election officials to falsify the vote count. That's not equivalent.

Clinton surrounded herself with mainstream aides and strategists. Trump hired Team Nut Burger to pursue whacko legal theories that test the limits of our democracy. That's not equivalent.

Clinton complains about how she should have won but accepts that she did not. Trump tries to overthrow the votes of 78 million people to reverse a loss. Yet you claim that since both did not like losing, their actions are essentially equivalent? That is the definition of false equivalence.

[Honda]

I agree with most of what you said about Trump but I think you've taken it way too light on Clinton. She's a crook. She funded and pushed an illegal scheme to prevent Trump from being elected and further to permanently damage his administration. In my mind that can never be overlooked.

[Kevin]

I think she's a crook as well. That character issue again.

I'm not trying to overlook her misdeeds. I'm only focused on the issue of equivalence in how they treated their election losses since that was what Scooter was talking about. There is plenty of fodder for opprobrium with Clinton and my argument about nonequivalence in how she and Trump handled defeat should not be taken as approval for her generally or minimization of her many many misdeeds, from Whitewater right up to the Steele Dossier. She's a dirty politician.

Neither Trump nor Clinton are unalloyed evil, though. Trump did some good things as President and I've given him credit for recognizing how important it is to confront China. Clinton understood that Russia is our enemy with Putin as its leader. They both had some good points so if someone is looking for equivalence, I'd say that is where it is - they both were flawed but they both had some good points.

[Sandman]

Hillary is a “has been” .. old news.. the only press Hillary receives is from “Foxish” outlets.. she is “chum” that still excites the listeners/viewers. She sells..

[Dave Grubb]

She sells..

I would hope she sells to only the most rabid among us. She is now just another footnote in history.