Confederate Statues

[Kevin]

The Virginia Supreme Court just okayed taking down statues to Confederate generals.

I get why people support taking them down but the vitriol involved bothers me. Yes, the whole Civil War was terrible. These men fought for the continuation of slavery. I get it.

But I also know that they fought for their state in a time before we thought of ourselves in the same terms we do know. Your state, your county - these were extremely important. The land of your birth was a lot more localized then, before the War. I also know that these generals often provided spectacular examples of courage under fire, and grace in defeat. Some didn't, sure, but many did what they did out of a sense of loyalty to the people they grew up with, however misguided the overall cause of slavery.

And they gave a defeated and beaten section of the country something to feel good about, no small thing after a civil war, which can often simmer for generations. It helped, being able to point to something that made you feel proud. ****, the soldiers at the time often cheered their enemies for marvelous displays of courage under fire.

So maybe the time for these statues is past and they need to go. But I don't like to see them caught up in today's hyper partisan war. They fought their own war. I'd really like to see cooler heads emerge on this subject so we can maybe find a way to honor these generals without also seeming to be insensitive to people's needs today. I don't think it is quite so easy to say "they fought for slavery, they were traitors". They fought for many things, but I bet foremost in their minds would have been for their state, right or wrong. That sort of example of loyalty is worth remembering even while we recognize their flaws.

And don't get me going on taking down statues to Washington or Jefferson. Totally against that.

[Mike]

.....And don't get me going on taking down statues to Washington or Jefferson. Totally against that.

Both were slave owners and deserve the same treatment as the rest. Erase the Constitution, too. Far too many ties to slavery for it to stand.

Isn't cancel culture great? Nothing bad has ever happened if we keep a ready eraser. Kids will love not having history classes. No need for civics, either. Nothing will ever happen.

[Kevin]

Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past.

George Orwell, "1984"

[Mike]

If there is no past, then there is no future. There is only today.

Me, Today

[Sandman]

Charlottesville case..

I’m in Virginia.. most of the statues were erected after reconstruction (1890-1920) by the Daughters of the Confederacy .. when they were erected Jim Crow was the general rule so any portion of the population that objected could not object..


Fast forward to 2020-2021.. the monuments now reside in jurisdictions that the majority population does not support the monuments..

Washington & Jefferson? Arlington is the name of the Curtis-Lee plantation..

[Dave Grubb]

My real regret---we seem entirely unable or unwilling to have an intelligent discussion about this

Added in edit: "we" does not mean this group, "we" means us as a country.

[Honda]

The only statue I care about is Nick Saban outside of Bryant Denny Stadium.

[Mike]

My real regret---we seem entirely unable or unwilling to have an intelligent discussion about this

America has become too damned stupid for intelligent discussions. The end of America as we have known it is passing us by. I shudder when I think of what is coming.

[Dave Grubb]

America has become too damned stupid for intelligent discussions. The end of America as we have known it is passing us by. I shudder when I think of what is coming.

I'm not to that point yet---but I am also an incorrigible optimist. That said---the place of beginning is with our politicians---they can be and are the model the rest of the country observes on an ongoing basis. When supposedly intelligent thoughtful people are unable/unwilling to communicate it provides a sad example for everyone else.

[UTAH]

America has become too damned stupid for intelligent discussions. The end of America as we have known it is passing us by.

I think you are far more open and progressive, Mike.

You have continued to support and maintain this very democratic site for years. You are way out in front of strictly monitored sites that clamp down on anyone pushing the envelope.

I still fondly recall getting recruited to join this site. Our prior site, where most of us met, was getting rid of political discussion - which was getting in the way of discussing PSDs. You bore the major expenditures and the time it took to pull all this together. We have not forgotten what you did for us, and we will not.

Thank you, Mike - for all you've done and all you continue to do.

Hunter

[Truckman]

I agree wholeheartedly with Hunter......Ben

[Phillbo]

well said Hunter!


And thanks Mike !

[Dave Grubb]

Yes sir---I could not have said it better

[Ferraridriver]

As my seventh grade teacher, Sister Mary Ursula, always said "Never say also when too will do" so I will say

Me too

[Sandman]

Me also..

Sister John (the heretic nun)totally confused me..