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Thread: Are we at a cross roads?

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Grubb View Post
    that said, I give no quarter to those people that attacked our Capital.

    The attempt to equate these goons and what they did, to the riots in the cities is sad. I do not, in any way, condone trashing property of any sort, but comparing looting a CVS to desiccating the nations Capital, with the intent of killing (hang Pence) the members of Congress is beyond comparison.
    I agree with most of this post. And for the record, I don’t believe I commented on the boring comparisons between last summer and this. Each should stand on its own.

    However, I am still thankful that the numbskulls who broke into the Capital didn’t do more damage than they did. I imagine some of them even stood in awe as I did the time I got a tour. I honestly believe if BLM had done the same, the place would have been torched and gutted. Especially the symbols of a history they resent.

    Nothing in this post should be misinterpreted to absolve the trumpsters of their crimes. Hang em, I couldn’t care less.
    "Back after 5 years. I thought you had died.

    don"


    Splitting my time between the montane and the mesas

    The woods are lovely, dark and deep.
    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep.

  2. #32
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    I like the Rob and Laura reference!!

    Just pointing out that there was a time before the Internet. We ousted a President without Twitter, stopped a war without Facebook and generally had pretty good lives before the digital age. I don't know how old you are but I thought it was was important to point that out. Social media is just entertainment, in the final analysis.

  3. #33
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    We are on the same page.

    I just read an editorial in the WSJ saying that trump isn't guilty of incitement---I disagree---but then I am not a lawyer. That said it tastes like incitement, it looks like incitement, it acted like incitement---I think I will stick with incitement.
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    I like the Rob and Laura reference!!

    Just pointing out that there was a time before the Internet. We ousted a President without Twitter, stopped a war without Facebook and generally had pretty good lives before the digital age. I don't know how old you are but I thought it was was important to point that out. Social media is just entertainment, in the final analysis.
    I don’t live in the digital age really. I only go to 2 “social media sites”; the other being a hunting site. I didn’t get an ATM card until 5 years ago when I retired and started having to use my own money.

    But I think the internet is more than entertainment any more. I use it for learning and to get my news since I only go to town every couple of weeks usually. It’s where I read my local paper.

    So it’s not just entertainment. But outside of a crime such as identity theft, fraud, etc the worst thing that can happen to you on the internet is to get your feelings hurt. Anything more than that is on you.
    "Back after 5 years. I thought you had died.

    don"


    Splitting my time between the montane and the mesas

    The woods are lovely, dark and deep.
    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep.

  5. #35
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    Fair enough. I was specifically focusing on the social media aspect of the Internet, as that is where the censorship was happening. I get a lot from the rest of the Internet as well but overall, I think it is kind of overrated.

    I would like to stop time in 1976. War over, Nixon gone, cars could be fixed at home, life was less hectic and more quiet.

  6. #36
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    Since you asked, Social media sites, if private businesses, should be allowed to restrict speech as they see fit. And the owners should be indemnified from opinions expressed by others.

    If they have criminal involvement with the users of their platform (allowing doxing for example) and profit thru the publication or distribution, well that’s a different matter. I think that’s where we’re at.
    "Back after 5 years. I thought you had died.

    don"


    Splitting my time between the montane and the mesas

    The woods are lovely, dark and deep.
    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Grubb View Post

    I am also encouraged by Simon & Shuster standing up to the "traitor" hawley---we need more companies to take a stand. (as a side note I think he should be expelled)
    seems that you are okay with censorship as long as they're censoring something that you do not agree with or do not like.

    If that's the case you don't believe in freedom of speech at all.

    That's not what freedom of speech is or about.

    Maybe I misread what you said but by what I quoted above I don't think so.
    07HEMI4ME

    A Friend Will Help You Move, But a Real Good Friend Will Help You Move a Body... He will not ask why you are digging the hole or what is in the bag.

  8. #38
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    Re: the freedom of speech.....
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
    Doesn't say others can't restrict one ability to say and do what they want. Book company is free to not publish someone's thoughts. Sites like twitter, FB and others can monitor what being on their sites.

    Now to the President's actions I believe that it falls under this:
    Freedom of speech does not include the right:

    To incite actions that would harm others (e.g., “[S]hout[ing] ‘fire’ in a crowded theater.”).
    Schenck v. United States, 249 U.S. 47 (1919).
    Fred

    "Everyday I beat my own previous record for number of consecutive days I've
    stayed alive."

    'Take care of yourself, and each other.'

  9. #39
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    Private company which has no obligation to publish Hawley's book in the first place, anymore than Mike has an obligation to allow speech he doesn't like on this site.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by 07HEMI4ME View Post
    seems that you are okay with censorship as long as they're censoring something that you do not agree with or do not like.

    If that's the case you don't believe in freedom of speech at all.

    That's not what freedom of speech is or about.

    Maybe I misread what you said but by what I quoted above I don't think so.
    You read it correctly and I think your question has been fairly answered by others in the same way I would have responded.
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity, an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty” ---Sir Winston Churchill
    "Political extremism involves two prime ingredients: an excessively simple diagnosis of the world's ills, and a conviction that there are identifiable villains back of it all." ---John W. Gardner
    “You can’t go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending.” ---C. S. Lewis

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