immigration with no control

[Dave Grubb]

Dave, I do not have a subscription to the Times. The article was posted on Brietbart and I read it and thought it would further the discussion I started.

You don't need a subscription to read some number of issues/month.

Dimbart is an unabashed rabid right platform, what kind of slanted interpretation would anyone expect?

I also will note that there is a disclaimer on pretty much anyone's OpEd page by the publisher disavowing the thought that any OpEd expresses the the position of the paper.

That said---agree or disagree---why would anyone espousing a totally closed boarder (i.e. Lou Dobbs) not expect there is some equal nit wit espousing a totally open border---that's life.

[FredK]

IV as for all your ranting about no one caring about the border that's a false premise.

It's just different versions on how much people want to focus on minute things. As soon as any serious discussions take place someone wants to throw up road blocks about who crossed and those that already are in here.

I've always been a fan of having people cross and be given a green card and a SS number so they can work legally. That said those that want to obtain benefits must be US citizens before they can get any benefits. If they want to claim asylum that's a process they need to apply for and another for citizenship.

Now before you want to cry about the rapist/murderers and drugs that's a separate issue, just like those that are already in this country.

So if you and Joe want to lump them altogether then just quit asking what my position is.

[UTAH]

I've always been a fan of having people cross and be given a green card and a SS number so they can work legally. That said those that want to obtain benefits must be US citizens before they can get any benefits. If they want to claim asylum that's a process they need to apply for and another for citizenship.

Not only well put, Fred - but I agree fully with your stance.

Hunter

[Honda]

Not only well put, Fred - but I agree fully with your stance.

Hunter

In a world of pristine optimism and idealism I would agree with both of you. Unfortunately I do not find myself in that situation presently.

[Independent Voter]

IV as for all your ranting about no one caring about the border that's a false premise.

It's just different versions on how much people want to focus on minute things. As soon as any serious discussions take place someone wants to throw up road blocks about who crossed and those that already are in here.

I've always been a fan of having people cross and be given a green card and a SS number so they can work legally. That said those that want to obtain benefits must be US



citizens before they can get any benefits. If they want to claim asylum that's a process they need to apply for and another for citizenship.

Now before you want to cry about the rapist/murderers and drugs that's a separate issue, just like those that are already in this country.

So if you and Joe want to lump them altogether then just quit asking what my position is.

Fred, I never said that people do not care about the boarder or those crossing it.

I have also said I am all for LEGAL immigration. ILLEGAL immigrants should be returned to their home country. No green card, no ssn no work.

Allow Visa or Master Card to control the boarder. Issue a card for workers and let them swipe in and out. Overstay your allowed time [ don't pay your bill ] and they will hound you till you die. The cards could be issued by the employers for a certain time limit. [ I need 30 fruit pickers for the period Aug 1 - Sept 30 . ] They then go back home. Don't go home, they are found and never again allowed to get a work card.

Your last two points no bennies and apply for citizenship I completely agree with.

We are closer that you may think. I am just against ILLEGALS.

[wacojoe]

...I've always been a fan of having people cross and be given a green card and a SS number so they can work legally. That said those that want to obtain benefits must be US citizens before they can get any benefits. If they want to claim asylum that's a process they need to apply for and another for citizenship...

I welcome your response to my challenge, but I have some questions. You do not explain the qualification or process for obtaining a green card in your statement. Should your statement be read to mean everyone who crosses our border, even illegally, should be given a “green card,” meaning a certification legalizing their subsequent stay, or that there first must be a qualifying procedure to obtain one other than mere presence?

[UTAH]

In a world of pristine optimism and idealism I would agree with both of you. Unfortunately I do not find myself in that situation presently.

Understood. For what it's worth, I was not going after your position.

Hunter

[FredK]

I welcome your response to my challenge, but I have some questions. You do not explain the qualification or process for obtaining a green card in your statement. Should your statement be read to mean everyone who crosses our border, even illegally, should be given a “green card,” meaning a certification legalizing their subsequent stay, or that there first must be a qualifying procedure to obtain one other than mere presence?

Why do you want to pre-qualify someone? Shouldn't take any longer than getting a drivers license.

[wacojoe]

Then you are for open borders, correct, Fred.

There are qualifying rules now for green cards, but I guess you are advocating for tossing them out and giving one to anyone who asks, perhaps save for convicted criminals. What have I missed here?

I am not conversant with our present green card rules, but I am assuming they are written to be awarded to those who we want into the country for our purposes, but my read is you want green card rules written for the purposes of anyone who wants to come here regardless of their usefulness to us.

[Honda]

Understood. For what it's worth, I was not going after your position.

Hunter

Oh I know you're a good guy we're just on opposite sides of the political Spectrum

[mgrist]

IV as for all your ranting about no one caring about the border that's a false premise.

It's just different versions on how much people want to focus on minute things. As soon as any serious discussions take place someone wants to throw up road blocks about who crossed and those that already are in here.

I've always been a fan of having people cross and be given a green card and a SS number so they can work legally. That said those that want to obtain benefits must be US citizens before they can get any benefits. If they want to claim asylum that's a process they need to apply for and another for citizenship.

Now before you want to cry about the rapist/murderers and drugs that's a separate issue, just like those that are already in this country.

So if you and Joe want to lump them altogether then just quit asking what my position is.

Fred took a position on something? Fred actually came up with a thought of his own? Has a position on something? The first time in 17 years that he made a statement all his own??? BS he read it somewhere and plagerized it, I'd bet my last dollar on it!

[Dave Grubb]

IV---I have to take the time to go back to your point of the homeless. I chose not to respond to many of your statements that I disagreed with---but this one is "stuck" and I need to speak to it.

The homeless are mostly made up of people who choose to be homeless and the last thing they want is a job. Most could work if they were drug or alcohol free but for that reason are rendered jobless. Some are impaired, either physically or mentally---and those are the saddest of the lot---and we as a society fail them.

That said----there are far more entry level jobs going begging than all the homeless added together. There is little reason for anyone to be unemployed in this country today---and stopping immigration will not change the lot of those who are and will remain homeless.

[Truckman]

Some are impaired, either physically or mentally---and those are the saddest of the lot---and we as a society fail them.

Our biggest failure in that regard is in allowing those that profit from illegal drug dealing, and their enablers to continue living...Those such as El Chapo, and all his toadlings, who are not hunted down and killed are only encouraged by his future retirement plans in which he is allowed to exist when he should have been reduced to ashes when first identified......Ben

[mgrist]

Our biggest failure in that regard is in allowing those that profit from illegal drug dealing, and their enablers to continue living...Those such as El Chapo, and all his toadlings, who are not hunted down and killed are only encouraged by his future retirement plans in which he is allowed to exist when he should have been reduced to ashes when first identified......Ben

You make me sound good Ben. I totally agree with the Chapo type characters, Mexico has spent millions as have we and now we'll support him the rest of his life. They/we know of a lot of the people he has had killed, the drugs he has exported ..we're far to easy on criminals but we've got to many people in high places that will lie people into the electric chair just to spare themselves.etc... That's why we have the system we have and that's why the El Chapo's of this world never get justice.
But you knew that.

[Truckman]

But you knew that.

Sadly, yes......Ben