Well here we go

[Honda]

Yeah and maybe you'll listen to The Courts when they bitch slap California

[Fulltimer]

Yeah and maybe you'll listen to The Courts when they bitch slap California

Only if the courts want to plow new ground.

[Honda]

The supremacy clause and the jurisprudence behind it is probably some of the most well settled law in this country

[Fulltimer]

The supremacy clause and the jurisprudence behind it is probably some of the most well settled law in this country

The Supremacy Clause does not say states have to enforce federal regulations.

States do not have to enforce federal environmental regulations, income tax regulations, or immigration regulations.

It will be interesting to see if a court will plow new ground on who enforces those regulations and who pays for the enforcement.

[wacojoe]

California passed laws affirmatively interfering with federal immigration law and enforcement policy. They went so far as to pass legislation imposing fines on employers who attempt to find out the residency status of their employees — status which, if illegal, could cost those employers huge fines if irregular. The California Attorney General has proactively made a large public splash announcing he and his team of jackbooted state employed thugs will make examples of any transgressors seeking to learn the residency status of their employees to cooperating with federal immigration officials in doing so despite the federal penalties that may result should they not. That portion alone puts its own citizens and business owners between a rock and a hard place.

The courts need to provide relief. Disputes between states and feds is the #1 reason they are there.

[Fulltimer]

California passed laws affirmatively interfering with federal immigration law and enforcement policy. They went so far as to pass legislation imposing fines on employers who attempt to find out the residency status of their employees — status which, if illegal, could cost those employers huge fines if irregular. The California Attorney General has proactively made a large public splash announcing he and his team of jackbooted state employed thugs will make examples of any transgressors seeking to learn the residency status of their employees to cooperating with federal immigration officials in doing so despite the federal penalties that may result should they not. That portion alone puts its own citizens and business owners between a rock and a hard place.

The courts need to provide relief. Disputes between states and feds is the #1 reason they are there.

I thought what the California law said was if an employer turned over employee records to ICE when they demanded them without a warrant they could be fined.

Everyone should always demand to see a warrant before supplying any records to any authorities.

[wacojoe]

You may be correct on what the California law is; I have not kept up closely, as it is a hell of their own making, I am glad to not be a part of, but if what you say is correct, then what I concluded about the law actively interfering with immigration enforcement bears out.

[Fulltimer]

You may be correct on what the California law is; I have not kept up closely, as it is a hell of their own making, I am glad to not be a part of, but if what you say is correct, then what I concluded about the law actively interfering with immigration enforcement bears out.

A good presentation of General Session's claims compared to the 3 laws in question is here:
http://www.politifact.com/california...rnia-bans-pol/

I think the courts will be able to sort it out.

It's difficult to leave out pertinent parts when litigating with skilled attorneys in our adversarial system.

[TxMusky]

What about the employers 1st amendment rights of free speech, they can do what they want with their own private records.

Now correct me if I am wrong lawyers, but a State has jurisdiction over most things within it's borders. When a border is crossed it becomes a federal case does it not? The reason I say this is because I have seen laws broken, say a robbery or a kidnapping, and the person who committed the act goes to another State, now the feds can get involved. Am I wrong on this?

That would mean, if a person crossed the border coming into our Country they crossed not only the border but a State line, so the feds should have all jurisdiction over it. Not to mention that federal law Trumps State law, and immigration or entering our Country is federal territory to begin with. To get a visa you apply to the federal govt, not the State.

[Fulltimer]

What about the employers 1st amendment rights of free speech, they can do what they want with their own private records.

Now correct me if I am wrong lawyers, but a State has jurisdiction over most things within it's borders. When a border is crossed it becomes a federal case does it not? The reason I say this is because I have seen laws broken, say a robbery or a kidnapping, and the person who committed the act goes to another State, now the feds can get involved. Am I wrong on this?

That would mean, if a person crossed the border coming into our Country they crossed not only the border but a State line, so the feds should have all jurisdiction over it. Not to mention that federal law Trumps State law, and immigration or entering our Country is federal territory to begin with. To get a visa you apply to the federal govt, not the State.

You do seem to be partly correct. Robbery, Kidnapping, Rape, Murder, and about 800 other serious crimes by the undocumented are ones that local, county, and state police are required under the California law to notify ICE and can release those detained to the Federal Government. I'm not sure who would have the right to try them for those crimes though. I wouldn't want a murderer to be sent to immigration court to be deported.

The way I read it, California is not required under their law to detain and report to ICE a victim of a crime or a person with a minor offense such as a traffic ticket. SB 54 http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/fa...=201720180SB54

Employers are not given carte blanche to publish employee's records and under the California law they are required to release those to ICE only if ICE has a court order. AB-450 http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/fa...201720180AB450

The federal government is the only entity charged with making and enforcing immigration regulations. It is not the duty of local, county, or state governments to do that job.

There was a similar problem in the past with getting states to spend their resources on drug enforcement. The federal government came up with a scheme to get the police departments across the nation on board. It was the asset forfeiture law that allowed law enforcement agencies to keep a portion of assets from suspected drug users.

[TxMusky]

The local officials are not enforcing the immigration law in this case. The criminals were already in jail for things they did other than illegal immigration. They were already criminals twice, once when the crossed the border illegally and second, for whatever it was that the locals picked them up for. This whole thing is just plain dumb.

For instance, if you and I were neighbors and I saw a robber climbing out of your window with a bag of stolen items from your house. You come home and run out the door looking around and tell me, "My house was broken into and all of my stuff was stolen. Did you see anything"?

And if I looked at you and said "oh yea, I saw the guy coming out of your window with all of your things".

Then you would say "Why didn't you stop him, he got my wifes wedding ring"?

I just look back at you while I was walking off and replied "wasn't my house he was robbing".

[Fulltimer]

The local officials are not enforcing the immigration law in this case. The criminals were already in jail for things they did other than illegal immigration. They were already criminals twice, once when the crossed the border illegally and second, for whatever it was that the locals picked them up for. This whole thing is just plain dumb.

For instance, if you and I were neighbors and I saw a robber climbing out of your window with a bag of stolen items from your house. You come home and run out the door looking around and tell me, "My house was broken into and all of my stuff was stolen. Did you see anything"?

And if I looked at you and said "oh yea, I saw the guy coming out of your window with all of your things".

Then you would say "Why didn't you stop him, he got my wifes wedding ring"?

I just look back at you while I was walking off and replied "wasn't my house he was robbing".

That is probably exactly what I would say if I were in your position after I had called the police and given them a description of the thief. It is not your job to try to stop someone breaking into my house.

In over 800 serious crimes committed by undocumented immigrants the law enforcement authority is required under the California law SB54 to notify ICE and release them to ICE custody if ICE will take them.

[TxMusky]

And another reason why I am glad we are not neighbors. You don't get it still, there was not even a phone call made. You watch them break in and let them do what they want without reporting anything. The feds made the call to the cops and the cops basically snuck the crooks a warning so that they could escape.

That would be like me loaning the robber your car to get away.

[Fulltimer]

And another reason why I am glad we are not neighbors. You don't get it still, there was not even a phone call made. You watch them break in and let them do what they want without reporting anything. The feds made the call to the cops and the cops basically snuck the crooks a warning so that they could escape.

That would be like me loaning the robber your car to get away.

I am glad we are not neighbors as well. You would expect me to risk my life to try to save your wife's ring... No, that would not be my job.

Call your insurance agent. Things are not worth dying for.

[Wannabe]

I am glad we are not neighbors as well. You would expect me to risk my life to try to save your wife's ring... No, that would not be my job.

Call your insurance agent. Things are not worth dying for.

Are you by chance of French extraction? How is a 911 phone call putting your life in danger?