Malhuer National Wildlife Reserve Armed Protest

[2ndthyme]

You decide.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjl1hefqqWI
Was he reaching for something or not?

he dropped his hands to his chest twice and turned to avoid capture. he got what anyone else would expect to get,,, dead

[mgrist]

I agree with all of that, in principal and in fact when it is done as you explained. Bundy for one didn't agree with you, then he started a ruckus with a really big bully and dragged down a bunch of other people that should have known better. The mentality that somebody owes me something just sends me reeling, Bundy was under the impression that the fed owed him something, they don't, not even the time of day. They also don't play nice but Bundy kept pushing. Fact of the matter is were a real uprising to start I'd be on the front lines against any and all things government, I wouldn't be standing beside a Bundy though, he'll get you killed. Bundy's final straw was when he started his negro speeches; "Were they better off having been slaves blah blah blah" All of his support went down the drain and I say again, he just kept pushing, what did he expect?

[Wannabe]

You ever notice that when trouble starts Outsiders come and start turning up the heat until it reaches the flash point and it rarely winds up good for the community. Let's not forget the Media's role in helping the outsiders turn up the heat. The Media prefers that things ends badly so they can boost their ratings a little higher.

[mgrist]

You ever notice that when trouble starts Outsiders come and start turning up the heat until it reaches the flash point and it rarely winds up good for the community. Let's not forget the Media's role in helping the outsiders turn up the heat. The Media prefers that things ends badly so they can boost their ratings a little higher.

Couldn't agree more! I imagine they played an big part in the rhetoric from both sides.

[Mike]

You ever notice that when trouble starts Outsiders come and start turning up the heat until it reaches the flash point and it rarely winds up good for the community. Let's not forget the Media's role in helping the outsiders turn up the heat. The Media prefers that things ends badly so they can boost their ratings a little higher.

Yep!

[blaze]

One thing not covered in Harney county is the corruption that they can uncover and how the whole community has had irreparable damage to it and to the point of violence. Mainstream wont cover this. Govt don't like it. This is taking place in the heart and soul of America!

Oh and the latest news I got are the two women in the back seat got cell phone coverage of the first stop. Fbi fired two shots that hit the passenger mirror. The two girls panicked and would not get out and he bolted. All this on their cells phones until they hit the snowbank. Lavoy got out and said "well then just shoot me" and they shot at him the second he got out with his arms up. His hands went down as he was covering the wounds and tried to surrender again and same thing. They even shot him on the ground. After that they unloaded on the truck but couldn't get an angle.....this is what these two gals say. Evidence is obviously the truck and CELL PHONE which has not been shown. The two girls are in hiding.

[Phillbo]

I you people would turn off your TV's the media would fail. Everyone blames the media while they are sitting there watching the media.

I know jack about this situation other than what I have read here because i don't watch 'the media'.

[FredK]

Yes the govt needs to release its hold on the land and give it back to the State in which the land is located......

Why and how do you figure that's a fair return for the government's investment, which I grant been paid may times over. The whole turn it over to the state isn't fair and to turn it over to theose that can afford it at auction wouldn't be fair either.

When you get a better solution to the problem I be willing to hear it.

[Wannabe]

Check this out.
http://www.fromthetrenchesworldrepor.../hr3013116.mp3

[TxMusky]

When you get a better solution to the problem I be willing to hear it.

Any solution is better than what is happening now. The land and the people are being screwed by feds who have no clue as to what they are doing. If the land has been paid for many times over then why does the ownership not transfer over to the State in which the land is enclosed? What good is it doing just having the unused land sitting there under BLM management? I can almost guarantee that private ownership would create a situation that the feds could collect taxes off of, whether it be for grazing or any other use that private sector could bring in. Even if it just sat there, the owners would have to pay taxes on it! With the feds owning it, there is no revenue generated and having to pay a govt employee to oversee or run the land is not generating income, in fact it is costing the taxpayers money paying for the salaries as the other dollars it takes to have it under federal ownership.

Some complain about the ranchers paying to run cattle on the land, but what else is it being used for? At least ranchers are paying something and using the land as nature has used it before people got involved. Did the feds charge the deer, bears and rabbits to eat there?

[FredK]

Any solution is better than what is happening now. The land and the people are being screwed by feds who have no clue as to what they are doing. If the land has been paid for many times over then why does the ownership not transfer over to the State in which the land is enclosed? What good is it doing just having the unused land sitting there under BLM management? ......

Some complain about the ranchers paying to run cattle on the land, but what else is it being used for? At least ranchers are paying something and using the land as nature has used it before people got involved. Did the feds charge the deer, bears and rabbits to eat there?

Tx using your explanation then if we took over your land and give you nothing for it, you would be ok with that? After all it's been paid many time over from when it was what stolen from Mexico who stole it from some Indian tribe, etc..... Sure you or the "bank" hold some title but who originally held that?

The BS being spewed is the government screwed up and I don't buy into it as only the government by those that used it without maintaining it. Two sides and both are correct depending on how one looks at it.

I can almost guarantee that private ownership would create a situation that the feds could collect taxes off of, whether it be for grazing or any other use that private sector could bring in. Even if it just sat there, the owners would have to pay taxes on it! With the feds owning it, there is no revenue generated and having to pay a govt employee to oversee or run the land is not generating income, in fact it is costing the taxpayers money paying for the salaries as the other dollars it takes to have it under federal ownership.

So you want dipstick to pay up for the grazing or not?

[blaze]

Utah's Governor Gary Herbert and his legislature has been attempting to get answers from the fed gov't for 3 years - and no answer. So now Utah is moving forward to seize lands from the feds

[Dave Grubb]

So now Utah is moving forward to seize lands from the feds

I keep asking but so far I haven't received an explanation--- so I'll try again.

On what grounds do the States claim ownership of this land over the Federal Government?

[mgrist]

I guess I just don't get it. It's federal land it's not the states land. They (The Feds) don't have to use it and they don't have to allow anybody else to use it. People keep inventing all these new laws that tells the feds what they can and can't do, it doesn't work that way. It doesn't matter if we think it wrong or right it is what it is. Maybe it's strategic in case of an invasion, maybe there are missile silos? Maybe the feds just want to keep it natural?? More than likely it's there's simply because they can. If the ranchers have something on somebody that is exactly what they have, something on "somebody" You can't beat city hall. This murder of the rancher, who are you going to lock up? Maybe the guy that pulled the trigger, maybe three or four others who were part of it but your not nor can you lock up the fed. Nope, they don't play fair, they make the rules though. We need to start with the politicians, figure out a way to get honest people in there, then and only then can you challenge the fed or reorganize it, get Reed and others like him out of it. Until there is a coup in DC nothing is going to change. Over the last fifteen years the feds have stripped us of half out freedoms and are steady working on whats left, "land rights" is a oxymoron.

[Truckman]

I keep asking but so far I haven't received an explanation--- so I'll try again.

On what grounds do the States claim ownership of this land over the Federal Government?

It's neither...It's ours, the people......Ben